Looks like you're new!

Join a server and type /password (password) to set a password for your account, you can login with it here.

Problems With Factions... So Far
  • Quotes From Dan.

    "That people who start out early have less of an advantage" - So I could come and wait all day on release day and there would be no gain, I would not be at an advantage to those who came weeks down the line and can come and be equal to me.

    "Well, some intelligent people might make smaller bases to start out and make money before you if you're building this huge 160 thing" - A small base which has to be claimed because you said containers outside claims wont work, would make you easier to raid. Who want's to be easy to raid, what person who even has no factions experience put spawners and valuables inside a "small" base? No one.

    "We're looking for a Factions server and community that allows new players to join later on and play for fun, not just competition" - Factions itself is a competitive game mode, it is a competition the strongest faction wins, the better the pvp'ers the more fights you win, the better the base builders the better the base you have, the better the cannoners you have the easier raids will be. This is a competition, especially if f top is introduced. This isn't skyblock. That clarifies the competition part, now onto the community, DC is one of the most toxic servers I've played on and it is the only one with a chat filter, the community I feel will not remain peaceful at all, I can hold my hands up and say I have contributed to this. I don't see the community of a COMPETITIVE game mode being anywhere near peaceful or welcoming. From what I am seeing you are looking to fix the player base issue, you want players who join to stay, and so are putting loyal long term ranked players at a disadvantage which I think is very unfair and not right even with morals aside, we didn't pay to be put at a disadvantage at all, when I bought emerald I didn't sign up for being put at a disadvantage 2 years later on the factions release.

    "Dancraft isn't as big as it used to be. We don't have the player base to supplement a huge Factions release" - Dancraft being smaller than it used to be with all due respect is no fault other than yours, we didn't leave the server because you left, we left because the server wasn't maintained, hackers took over and DC became an anarchy. I appreciate you came back and put a hell of a lot of effort in but putting ranked players and even unranked loyal players at a disadvantage because of this is simply obscene.

    EXPANDING BORDER ISSUE:

    My issue with the expanding border is that It puts those who COME EARLY at a disadvantage, The only reason for me to come on release day is to get a good claim which I feel is the foundation to a good start, a good claim would be a claim which would YES require LESS work but is countered by me coming EARLY in order to compete and fight for these spots/claims. If that is removed why would anyone make it for release day? Oh that's right they would get to experience the bugs first.

    I bet those for the border are arguing "don't come on release day then", I don't come on release day just for the claims, If you read the above a GOOD CLAIM is the FOUNDATION to a successful factions season, I don't come to a factions season with failure in mind. You don't come onto factions and go straight into fighting people and gathering loot without having a safe and secure place to store it, A safe and secure place would be claimed land because you can't place containers in unclaimed land, if you put valuables into claimed land, you protect it so you build a base and defences, the smaller the defences the more susceptible you are to getting raided, so you aim to get the most defences possible which is already limited by the 20 player cap limit. This difficulty is made harder because you have all 4 axis' of a claim to defend, as the server ages, people gain more materials to raid and are more capable to raid, so with this you have to work even hard to defend your base, genning walls can take days, yes this is made easier by Gen Buckets. You would need to Make money, and build your base up all season rather than make money and defend your base like the factions plugin description states.
    If I wanted to build all day I'd play build battle, if you want to make money all day, farm on skyblock, if you wanna pvp all day play ULTI, what I'm trying to emphasise here is that a BALANCE of all these things is KEY, the expanding world border RUINS this balance and creates this DIVIDE between servers.

    "You take it way to seriously just have fun", You want me to play on a server with my enemies and have fun whilst they compete to take me down, raid my base, fight me at pvp, beat me on spawner value? What fun is there in that? NONE

    "It's not just you at a disadvantage" - I'm glad you mentioned that and realise that this disadvantages everyone, what server do you know puts EVERYONE including those who donated at a disadvantage? (That is successful). NONE. I'd like a refund for my rank in that case.

    MINES:

    If Mines are disabled how will we get our otherwise unobtainable items such as spawners and creeper eggs etc?

    MCMMO:

    If the MCMMO is balanced correctly meaning if certain things are capped such as skull splitter ability, serrated strikes, unarmed disabled, mcmmo potions capped, then it could be okay.

    BEDROCK:

    If bedrock is obtainable but not dropped on breaking, why would I use it? I would just defend obsidian, the only thing that would change this is if Bedrocks required tnt to break it was significantly higher than obsidian, otherwise I would just use a massive hammer on a lein to break through the bedrock in one shot.

    RANDOM REWARD FOR MINING ORES:

    As I've stated over and over again if I wanted to mine to win I'd play prison.

    WORLD:

    Natural world generation is fine, other servers implement custom biomes which make the environment more appealing but not a problem.

    Daily reset of the nether I could only see being useful if I wanted to go to the nether every day to get the blaze spawners, otherwise what is it's use?

    No building in the end and basically no building in the nether due to it resetting means that all the bases have to be in the overworld, unless I am missing a dimension. This would make the world overcrowded, bases would be super close and with them being made so slowly due to the 4 axis required defences, more raids will happen earlier on which I find inconvenient and it would make or break someones faction season, you don't want loyal ranked/unranked players quitting earlier on because they are at a disadvantage because the playerbase needs to be fixed from no fault of their own.

    WORLD BORDER:

    This just confuses me, 5000 blocks to start is far to small, I don't know how you expect people to make a start on a base when people could RTP up to half way into the border making you being able to be found SO easily and having to deal with people putting claims in your claims, destroying your current progress, and being an overall pain because they don't care for the competition of factions.

    I'll continually Add to this as I think of more problems.

    Please if you share any of my views on the update add a comment below and push other who are in the same position to do the same! It could make or break the new 'Factions'.


  • I would have to agree. Dancraft used to be a big server, believe me. In fact, factions dominated the player count of all games combined. In my opinion, Dan and the staff team have wasted too much time and I don't think factions would be as popular as it used to be. Old players will not come back. Sometimes, the truth hurts.
  • @DCPolice Thanks for your response, I'm glad we're on the same wavelength!
  • First quote - less of an advantage, not at a disadvantage. The reasons for this are explained in the response to fourth quote.

    Second quote - smaller bases, not small bases. You were contiously expressing your plans to built the 160 something something base that honestly, won't be anywhere near as feasible with expanding borders. Perhaps smaller bases weren't required on previous Dancraft Factions versions (or other servers), but in this version, you may have to adapt.

    Third quote - what is wrong with this? I explained that the server will be competitive, as you would like. A competitive game can still be friendly and welcoming - a good example of this is any league based sport or eSport. The reason the game needs to allow new players to participate is because of the below quote:

    Fourth quote - The point isn't anything to do with why Dancraft isn't as big as it used to be. The point is that Dancraft isn't as big as it used to be. This means the Factions server, without allowing new players on, may end up having a very very small community. We need to consider growth here, it isn't anything about putting loyal players at a disadvantage (you still have an advantage), it's about maintaining a balance and making sure that future marketing campaigns are successful.

    In regards to the "expanding border issue":

    This whole "disadvantage" thing is ridiculous. Definition of disadvantage - an unfavourable circumstance or condition that reduces the chances of success or effectiveness.
    You are not at a disadvantage to those that start later in the season. This is because building a base within the first week (when the border expands by 1,000 blocks each day) still gives you an advantage over those who start at day 8 (you have items, money, power, etc and not forgetting the base itself). Everyone has to adapt to the change (not disadvantage).

    This doesn't create a divide between servers. A gamemode that does not cater for new players creates an isolated playerbase - if anything, this reduces any potential divide caused by your idea of a Factions server.

    That "You take it way to seriously just have fun" quote isn't a quote from me, I don't know who said that. If this is in regards to my comment about an environment that allows new players to have fun, this is completely incorrect.

    In regards to the spawners, we haven't yet decided how they will be released into the game. I have previously stated this will not be pay-to-win. One thing is for sure, spawners will be not be obtainable via in-game money and if ever obtainable via crates/store purchase, this will not be the sole way in which they can be obtained.

    If you have input in regards to MCMMO, please let us know. We requested input in regards to how people would like it configured in the main thread.

    Bedrock is stronger than obsidian.

    In regards to the mining for ores:
    image
    I think you have a misunderstanding in regards to mining rewards; players are rewarded for mining with random rewards, players don't have to mine to win. I welcome any suggestions on this front.

    In regards to the world generation:
    image
    We decided it was not worth dev time (we are releasing in 6 days) to implement this as it isn't something that has an overwhelming majority vote.

    Daily nether reset is because all bases should be built in the overworld. This is to encourage raiding which takes me onto your next point...

    This Factions season is all about raiding. We don't want people to get to the top and stay there. You have a 5000 block radius to make your base at the start, it is going to be challenging. It's starting to seem to me like this challenge might be too much for you! (that's a playful joke)

    Thank you for taking the time to write this thread. I hope you appreciate my response. My only suggestion would be to not "over exaggerate" for dramatic effect (i.e. all the stuff about putting loyal players at a disadvantage) and (the main thing), to propose solutions to the potential flaws in our features.
  • #1 There is no "over exaggeration" as you put it in this thread, I say it how it is, Period.

    #2 Think about what you are saying when you criticise me using the term disadvantage? You are not putting the players at and ADVANTAGE but instead are limiting their capability or in your terms, unfavourable circumstance or condition that reduces the chances of success or effectiveness. Put it that way in the rank description of the server store for every rank as that and see the response. Or put it that way in the faction release notes seen as you keep mentioning it. Didn't think you would.

    #3 You say smaller base I say smaller base, tomato tomato. Put a small base up against a big cannon and tell me how that works out for you.

    #4 You can campaign for all the marketing/advertising you like, the player base as you said yourself in the Discord discussion will undoubtedly decrease, I predict the decrease to be rapidly exponential, If you want my opinions on how to retain the player base just ask.

    #5 You said and I quote "without allowing new players ON" then something about a small community, with 20 man factions how do you expect players to communicate, talk and join together, i.e new players join old players even you can see this not happening. I get it you want new players to stay, but there are other ways around it than yes dare I say it putting us at a DISADVANTAGE.

    #6 I believe the world border issue creates a divide for the reasons I detailed above. You clearly are very keen on trying out this border plan nonsense so let's just see how it works out.

    #7 I did not say that was a quote from you, I know your fans will surely ask that question/make that statement so I responded accordingly. Not sure what you are trying to say is incorrect, I do want the server to be fun, but I will find it hard with some of these changes. Poor me I know.

    #8 The spawner scenario, cool I like that it isn't pay to win

    #9 Bedrock is stronger than obsidian <- just showing that I could have easily told you that. How much stronger this would be good to know pre-release.<br />
    #10 These graphs mean nothing to me, I cannot see who voted to determine whether or not they know much about factions, you asked for people to vote who plan on playing factions, I expected this from a server that has seen a large amount of new players who never played the old factions since DC's 'Revival'

    #11 As I said default world generation isn't a problem, please read what I say. If you're going to cherry pick which poll results you want to release, why not release them all?

    #12 You can encourage base building in every dimension if the borders are small, It takes me a few seconds to tp to another dimension, your argument is invalid, it's just as easy to find bases in any dimension if the borders are the same size because we can access all of them as quickly as the other.

    #13 YAY Factions is all about raiding, Cool you don't want people to get to the top and stay there but how many of those 47 poll voters can build a cannon that could get through more than 10 walls? Should have asked that question before you removed withers from the equation.

    #14 No problem, I'm passionate about Dancraft if you couldn't tell which Is why I am willing to go to extreme measures to ensure that I can do my best to fix these ridiculous changes. I feel you went slightly overboard with your jokes and mockery of my comments, for an admin you should consider how you respond. No I'm not bothered in any way shape or form by your remarks just making sure you take this on board next time someone challenges you and your server.

    I don't expect you to respond but I know you will read this DansTooGood. If you do respond please don't repeat yourself. This is a constant cycle and I know what I say will have no effect but I will feel accomplished knowing I tried.
  • I love this conversation with @RD_ and @admin, this is turning out to be entertaining for me and the server.
  • I have to agree with RD....... If you build a base in the first week and decide upon not building a big base with walls yet, you may choose to build a Skybase or a Dispenser base. With Dancraft's reputation you are guaranteed to be raided by someone using xray or tracers I don't see this as being balanced, It just gives the hackers an advantage within the first week. are they the people you want to stay? In addition to my previous point having a hacker ruled community (alike last version)
    either repels new players causing the factions community to die again, or encourages MORE hackers to join because they see Dancraft as an easy server to cheat on. In turn the community will turn more toxic. I think having a factions specific moderation team will help resolve this issue and you can make the anti-cheat flag for xray or other non combat hacks in the staff chat so they can tp and ban the hackers before they raid the base.


    :,(
  • @_SnoweyZ You managed to read the whole thing? GG
  • @Radgie Thanks for your input and for agreeing with my points!
  • I don't want to argue about semantics. I'll respond to every point you've made here (well, most) but in any future responses, only points directly related to the Factions release will be responded to.

    The "over exaggeration" was particularly in regards to the usage of the word disadvantage. You are not at a disadvantage to players who join later in the season. As previously said, a disadvantage is "an unfavourable circumstance or condition that reduces the chances of success or effectiveness". If everyone on the server suffers from the "circumstance or condition" in an equal manner, no one is at a disadvantage. Yes, things are different to our previous versions and you may be at less of an advantage with a Premium Rank or starting earlier on in the season, but that does not mean you are at a disadvantage. I am clarifying this because players who skim over the initial thread may believe they are at a disadvantage for having a rank or starting earlier on in the season.

    The term disadvantage wouldn't be used in that manner (rank descriptions, etc) as it is incorrect. I don't see where you're going with this?

    The term "smaller base" is not the same as the term "small base", it is not "tomato tomato". I picked on this word choice because I think you misunderstood what I said. A base in the corner or against the border will not be as feasible, meaning smaller bases than the one you proposed in Discord may be required. That is all. I apologize if this seems like I am picking on your word choice, that is not the purpose of this point. The purpose is to further clarify that a smaller base does not mean your base can't be capable of taking iron golem spawners, etc.

    Your suggestions are welcome. This change isn't because we want to spite all the current players, it's because we want the best for the server. I've stated that we aren't going to have store-only spawners and (at times before this), the server will not be pay-to-win. Our changes aren't simply business-based decisions, they are so that the Factions server on Dancraft will not be short lived.

    I apologize. Whilst I still don't see how this creates a divide, players claiming around/inside your claim is a legitimate concern and something that hadn't been thoroughly considered on our side. The border is 5,000 X to -5,000 Z. With the random teleport limited to 50% of the border and having a cooldown of 5 minutes, I don't think it will be too much of an issue. That said, we will make sure we have the necessary tools to expand the border in the event that this is prominent following release. If you do not think that the random teleport limitations will prevent said activities from taking place, I am more than happy to take on board any suggestions in regards to prevention of this.

    The bedrock comment was because you asked why someone would use bedrock over obsidian. I can see how bedrock may not be worth destroying if there is so little of it that someone can break through obsidian/people can't change up their base. I've taken note of this and it may be changed prior to release.

    Everyone gets an equal vote in these polls. You don't get to decide what votes have value. Don't put yourself on a pedestal and declare your vote (*or others votes, regardless of whether or not they are supportive of your side) more valid than others. Of course the votes will not be of value to you if you do not understand the concept of a poll like this.

    There isn't any cherry picking going on. We have used the results to assist in making decisions, not they are not the sole deciding factor. If you are looking for specific results, you're more than welcome to request them.

    We are passionate about Dancraft too! From this discussion, we've learned a lot about what you want to see and you have exposed potential flaws (like the containers in non-claimed land issue) that we've been able to fix. Thank you
  • holy fuck.k
  • I cant read all this
  • the bit that I did read is the expandable border and I don't like that.
  • Am I the only one that reads all of the big comments, or am I just hallucinating/weird?
  • Very intresting
  • We should be able to place chests, dispensers & furnaces in unclaimed land.
    Also you can only place tnt in dispensers, (this should be changed back to it's original state).
  • @xXTheGodZuesXx Exactly what I wanted say. But seeing how certain things are looking they will most likely not listen or make some kind of statement why they can't go along with it.

    I personally think dancraft has no chance whatsoever to get its original playerbase back, unless they do something that will blow our minds.
  • Dan said he doesn't want bases to go undetected, that rule got my based raided within 10 hours after I joined.